Okay, I have to get this out
Oct. 16th, 2011 10:32 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
sabotabbyI read the Occupy TO Twitter feed and immediately felt like an irrelevant old fogey.
Part of it is because I'm in an extraordinarily bad mood, compounded by the fact that sickness and circumstances are preventing me from participating as much as I'd like. But part of it is attributable to a hipster mindset of hearing things that I and fellow windmill-tilters have been saying for years. Today, for example, is the 10th anniversary of another Bay Street occupation in Toronto, after which we were derided as anarchists and terrorists for making the same critiques as Occupy Together is mostly lauded for.
And part of it is just that there's so much self-congratulation and so little analysis. For example, most of the Twitter feed is people talking about love, but then there's this:
O RLY? Because here's what a Metis activist on Facebook had to say:
I'm almost positive that these were the guys that I mentioned in my public post about the march. (I saw very few First Nations people at the march and occupation; two small groups had flags, but the one guy had a megaphone.) They had valuable contributions that were shut down in the name of symbolism. So much love and multiculturalism!
Another exchange between long-time activists:
Which was the problem, too, back when I used to be involved in anarchist groups. Like Occupy, we were primarily white, privileged, and young. We did a terrible job of engaging marginalized communities or supporting their frequently less glamorous struggle, even while we paid them lip service. We were students of history, emulating the methods and imagery of turn-of-the-century movements, but we had little connection with older generations of activists, who we tended to deride as sectarian and irrelevant. Now I feel like one of those old sectarians myself, though, of course, I will continue to participate, and my criticisms will be kept private to avoid detracting from the people actually putting their bodies on the line.
Don't get me wrong. I'm so glad Occupy is happening. Even if I have critiques, it's already so much more than I ever imagined I'd see in my lifetime. But if it's going to work, there has to be linkages made between existing social movements, especially the struggles of people of colour and immigrant communities, First Nations, and stodgy boring old labour. Until that happens, it might look like a revolution, but it's still a protest that stayed up past its bedtime.
Part of it is because I'm in an extraordinarily bad mood, compounded by the fact that sickness and circumstances are preventing me from participating as much as I'd like. But part of it is attributable to a hipster mindset of hearing things that I and fellow windmill-tilters have been saying for years. Today, for example, is the 10th anniversary of another Bay Street occupation in Toronto, after which we were derided as anarchists and terrorists for making the same critiques as Occupy Together is mostly lauded for.
And part of it is just that there's so much self-congratulation and so little analysis. For example, most of the Twitter feed is people talking about love, but then there's this:
For the first time in #CanadianHistory, the different cultures off this nation (incl. 1st nations ppl) found a common voice in #SOLIDARITY
O RLY? Because here's what a Metis activist on Facebook had to say:
I was disgusted 5 minutes after I showed up to Occupy. Some "marshall" walked up to a Native warrior group that had brought a flag and megaphone to speak and the fellow demanded that they do the "people's mic" nonsense. I have no idea what my cousins wanted to say but they had no chance to say it. I tried to catch up so I could film or ask them but I couldn't walk fast enough and they left before the march began. I suspect they wanted to talk about "de-colonizing" and what's wrong with occupying occupied land. I'm not impressed.
I'm almost positive that these were the guys that I mentioned in my public post about the march. (I saw very few First Nations people at the march and occupation; two small groups had flags, but the one guy had a megaphone.) They had valuable contributions that were shut down in the name of symbolism. So much love and multiculturalism!
Another exchange between long-time activists:
M: "its like every time new people join the movement they have to go through the same dumb stages. They seem to be learning fairly quickly ."
A: "why wouldn't you expect new people to go through the learning process?"
M: "I would expect them too. But reading a book or maybe talking to someone experienced would help them get through a lot quicker. or thinking for a second- 100% consensus is clearly never going to happen, which would be obvious is someone thought about it in detail for a few minutes"
Which was the problem, too, back when I used to be involved in anarchist groups. Like Occupy, we were primarily white, privileged, and young. We did a terrible job of engaging marginalized communities or supporting their frequently less glamorous struggle, even while we paid them lip service. We were students of history, emulating the methods and imagery of turn-of-the-century movements, but we had little connection with older generations of activists, who we tended to deride as sectarian and irrelevant. Now I feel like one of those old sectarians myself, though, of course, I will continue to participate, and my criticisms will be kept private to avoid detracting from the people actually putting their bodies on the line.
Don't get me wrong. I'm so glad Occupy is happening. Even if I have critiques, it's already so much more than I ever imagined I'd see in my lifetime. But if it's going to work, there has to be linkages made between existing social movements, especially the struggles of people of colour and immigrant communities, First Nations, and stodgy boring old labour. Until that happens, it might look like a revolution, but it's still a protest that stayed up past its bedtime.
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no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 02:46 pm (UTC)We don't have a teabagger infestation here despite Harper and an attempt to create an artificial Ford Nation (now falling apart as it becomes increasingly clear that Ford is incompetent and doesn't understand basic maths), but a surprising number of Occupy TO people seem to be Ron Paul supporters for whatever reason.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 02:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 02:17 am (UTC)And that's my take away on how this at least moving the dialogue a little more in big-picture terms. Aside from anarchists and other assorted commies and people written off as cranks*, people have been crititque things from the perspective that the system is okay, it's just policy that's problematic or a group with an agenda who is messed-up, ie. "This was is wrong", "we need more benefits for the poor" or "torture is wrong".
But now people are really taking the whole system to the task because emperor has no clothes once you have no job and you 401k is up in smoke, it's taken an economic catastrophe and people loosing their economic security bubble to see that, hopefully people will remember the lesson instead of ignore how broken everything if they see prosperity again. But until then it's good to see a systematic critique get in the news.
And the Ron Paul support!!!! It makes me want to scream, I saw photos of the event I couldn't attend yesterday and I guess there someone with a Gasden flag at the head of the march and people with anti-federal reserve/goldbug signs there to.
It shouldn't be surprising for here, Nevada has a very strong little l, "leave me alone", libertarian tradition and Ron Paul is very popular here, but still I don't think Occupy wants to out there flying Gasden flags because it is the de facto symbol of the tea party.
*and I am a proud crank ;)
no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 02:19 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 09:19 pm (UTC)I had an interesting discussion with some co-workers today. They were all really sympathetic to the anti-corporate critique, but one in particular got a sense that there were a lot of dumb potheads with no politics in charge, and another had heard a lot of anti-immigration sentiment. I didn't encounter many dumb potheads or racists, but without a strong anti-oppression/social justice direction, they're bound to get involved. And of course the Ron Paul people will show up anywhere they're not kicked out!
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 03:18 pm (UTC)I went to the one in Vancouver, which was quite big, and I was happy to see it but only in form and not in content. It just came off as a crazy circus of people's causes--animal rights people, dancing hippies, zeitgeist/truthers/larouchers/anti-taxers(??), and so on..
They also let whoever wanted to speak come on and say whatever they came up with on the spot, so much of the stuff was brutally bad (the worst one which was almost so-bad-it's-good was a high school girl whose speech consisted of a vignette about Mother Theresa's conversion to charity, Gandhi telling someone to be the change they want to see, and the fact that MLK once said "I have a dream" in front of a lot of people)..
Anyways, I'm super glad there were tons of people out, but I would almost have rathered someone be a hardass and disallow any previous groups from promoting themselves in this new protest, even groups I agree with like Kurdish Workers Party, unions, NOII, etc.. Like, they banned smoking at the march, couldn't they have banned Bring-Your-Own-Cause(tm) in the name of creating something new and exciting? ;)
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 03:20 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 04:44 pm (UTC)Needless to say, you're lucky to get one of these per city, never mind per individual group in the city.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 06:56 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 02:27 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 09:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 06:25 pm (UTC)This never happens for anything ever ever ever, with one single exception - guilds, which are organized to prevent access unless you've done this.
And it is absofuckinglutely what drives me crazy nutsest about the world. You could know, kid. It's in the books you won't read and the lectures you won't listen to and the elders you won't ask. As a consequence not only do you not know, you don't even know what you don't know, and even worse, you don't know what it is to know, so the first time some con man comes along with something that looks like something you believe that shit. Second order dunning-kruger - not only do you not know you're incompetent, you don't know what a 'competence' is.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 06:35 pm (UTC)1) wealth concentration distorting the democracy, which makes it impossible to do anything about:
2) lack of economic opportunity, or economic uncertainty for those who have found opportunity, driven by:
- lack of jobs
- high costs of entry
- economic predation.
It's not about remaking society on a fundamentally more egalitarian or humane line. It's not going to be about those things, ever. It's not really going to be intersectional because it's so narrowly - or if not narrowly, essentially - economic.
It's about making bourgeois society "work" again. It's fundamentally unradical. But that's also the secret of its appeal. They - we - may even get something out of it - shift the great ship a few degrees to port.
And it's not like radicalism staying true to its radicalism has - at least in North America - gotten anyone anything except self-righteous.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 10:11 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 10:08 pm (UTC)This is true.
At the Toronto one, there was a lot of talk about remaking society, songs about revolution, anti-capitalist signage and so on. I don't think it's the message that's unfocused—there's a message, and it's not a bad one, but it's certainly one that could benefit from understanding the successes and failures of previous struggles.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 10:40 pm (UTC)Here (London) someone on the news was saying it is about the lack of democracy due to corporate influence in politics, which I thought was a good place to start explaining what it was all abotu to my boyfriend (who is uneducated in these matters). But I got stuck after that. I just vaguely felt glad more and more people are protesting about crap, but convinced very little will come of it because the majority of the protesters will be appeased by small reforms.
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Date: 2011-10-16 10:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 10:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 10:19 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-16 10:31 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-18 11:14 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 01:09 am (UTC)I've been an activist for a long time (but also been out of it a long time and just started the process of getting back into being truly active in an activist and community organizing sense) but I can never truly get over the way that a kind of arrogance, impatience, impertinence and all around ableism affects our movement (did I just use the bloody phrase "our movement? Rly?)
I'm not sure I'm expressing it well Sabs but I know that a lot of mentally and emotionally diverse people I know have a lot to share. They have ideas of making a beautiful and just world but just communicate differently(which I'm told is also very true of a whole bunch of different cultural backgrounds and upbringings where communication happens so very differently and on different levels etc). It makes me wonder why and how (in a bad sense) all our cycles are so reinforcing.
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Date: 2011-10-17 11:02 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 02:03 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 11:04 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 02:46 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 11:03 am (UTC)I can't imagine aspiring to be part of the 1%. I consider myself relatively well-off financially but their degree of wealth is unimaginable.
no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 01:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 09:20 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 06:53 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 09:22 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-17 10:44 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-10-21 05:08 pm (UTC)I repeated some of that on Twitter. So quotable! If this entry were public, I would've linked to it. Seriously, that is such a great talking point. Go Sabo. <3
no subject
Date: 2011-10-22 01:05 am (UTC)